BEN—An interesting place to start on this I suppose would be the question of… Are these I-Beams really keychains? I often feel like I’m using the word “keychain” to help explain to others and, for that matter, myself to better understand the size, scale, likely price, etc of the object rather than its function of holding keys. It’s funny, I don’t think I use any keychain I’ve ever made to hold my keys. If it’s not a keychain…what is it?

ROTENDA—What is it? Comes to my mind again the word “monument” - which we have bounced around a few times in conversations of these I-Beams. You know, oftentimes I’d use my I-beam as an accessory. To my bag, clothing, wallet… or just having it in my hand. “Multi-purpose tool” perhaps? [Laughter]

BEN—Need to rewind quick. Regarding the i-beam, this whole thing is the result of a retailer I was working with that asked me to do a little capsule collection around Mies Van De Rohe’s work in Chicago. Did some graphic t-shirts, etc, but those didn’t feel like enough and I wanted some sort of physical “artifact” of his work. The i-beam was quite obvious. Making it into a “souvenir” of the capsule collection via a keychain made it accessible, etc, without needing to go crazy and make a sculpture. Really fell in love with it from there. 

ROTENDA—...and now we’ve got a reminder of his work in our pockets! Would you actually consider making a large one as a sculpture to nod at/celebrate Mies’s work?

BEN—For some reason my immediate reaction was like, a very quick “no” on this one. Perhaps because the buildings themselves are that? Would be effectively impossible to do anything better than his great buildings…or the of course the Barcelona Pavilion.

Also, maybe that was the moment when I realized that what graphic t-shirts are to most brands, keychains are to my brand. This lightweight graphical expression…but for Ben Edgar it’s in 3D form rather than a graphic.

ROTENDA—It’s an interesting view - which I’m taking from a zoomed out perspective where I see that you’ve been exploring different surface finishes and materials… It's the “graphic tee getting a new graphic ”.  Raced in thought: “marble  I-beam”! Whilst on it, what other materials and finishes do you want to explore? 

BEN—Super out there…but I’ve been thinking about rendering objects in actual ice. I haven’t really sorted what exactly about them being impermanent is interesting to me yet. I’ve also been tinkering with gold / platinum. Even on a super small scale. Something about an i-beam in a precious metal. This idea of truly honoring its value using a precious metal.

I was on a call the other day where we were talking about symbols that all great brands, companies, movements tend to have. It was the idea of a “physical logo” if that makes sense. I was asked to explain the i-beam keychain idea. I wanted to explain it quick…so kind of jumped into the deep end. The thought was, if the cross is a physical symbol/logo of Christianity, maybe one could say the i-beam is the physical logo/symbol of…building. Of construction. I’ve often wondered if that’s a bit too abstract of an idea. 

ROTENDA—“Building” ...plot twist to the abstraction of them as a keychain... “keys to/of a building”. I think this opens to the word building in itself fitting into different contexts. What does this symbolism of “building/construction” mean to you? 

BEN—I mentioned it a bit earlier, but it’s really about honoring the function that is an i-beam. Honoring the process of building / constructing something. I’ve become a bit fixated lately on simply the act of creating. Taking an idea and making it real. I have such immense respect for people who make their ideas a reality.

Actually, what are some other examples of “physical logos” that come to your mind? From brands, cultural movements, etc? 

ROTENDA—Hmm! I would say the Mods and Rockers sub cultures! A Vespa or a suit felt like physical logos to the Mods - and for the Rockers, a Triumph and leather jackets. I had not ask myself the question before. These physical identifiers are interesting - like they offer a tangible dose of a brand’s, movement’s experience. They’re the souvenirs from the museum store. 

BEN—I was going to bring up the same thing. The studded/spiked belts of the punk movement. A well worn ollie pad on a pair of shoes for a skater.

These ones that recently launched, the flexible ones. When the idea was first pitched to you, what was your initial reaction to an i-beam, something that is defined by its strength and rigidity, that is super flexible, bendy, even playful?

ROTENDA—I was very much fascinated by the contrast! Say that in an architectural studio, I think we might get fired [Laughter]. In itself, when I hear the word I-beam, my brain processes “strength”… rubber-I-beam! I thought we’re building free-form structures… relating this to the flexibility of rubber! What would Mies say?

BEN—Wow…hadn’t thought of that idea: free-form structures. You’re looking at it through a philosophical lens of freedom. I love that. I have to admit, mine was a bit more about some sort of contrast as you said, or maybe more so this idea of confusion that I love to play with. Helping to free my thoughts by making things from materials they “shouldn’t” be made from to push the limits. I prefer your free-form thought now.

And the colors? Funny we’ve never really talked about this really kind of literal / obvious color palette I seem to love. Perhaps a question is…if we’d only done a rubber i-beam in black vs the variety of colors it landed at, how would that change the object / concept?

ROTENDA—Great one. I had a moment here, your reference of the colour black. Firstly I think we’d feel prompted to make a very special kind of black! Remember BMW’s Vanta Black? In that - I think the black becomes the black suit one wears daily! I feel it adds confidence. Wouldn’t you think so? 

BEN—It’s interesting, you’re right that black has a sense or confidence, strength, a solid nature to it. Confidence as you say. But it already being an i-beam, I wonder if that would make it less philosophically interesting. Less of a story to unpack perhaps. To be fair, I don’t have a great reason for doing them in different colors. There is a chance it’s me relating “building” with Legos and those thinking of i-beams as Lego pieces. That’s a whole other conversation series though. [Laughter]

Regarding the manufacturing. This was the first moulded object we’ve done together. In a lot of ways it was a true unlock for me. Almost like I’d gained some sort of new skill. Always felt moulds were prohibitively expensive / out of reach. Outside or perhaps our normal text exchanges, did this prompt any new product ideas or even ways of thinking?

ROTENDA—Oh it absolutely has! I remember when you sent the first photo from the supplier, which was a really quick turnaround from sending them files to them already prototyping. I share the same with you on this - thought molding processes are financially complex. I must admit - I had this thought of “what can we design in rubber? But larger than the keychain”. Can be a journey on composites and their many properties. 

BEN—I also thought about scale and size. I also thought about how moulded rubber objects tend to be made as a inexpensive, if not even cheap, alternatives to other materials like leather, metal, glass, ceramic, etc. It made me want to reframe that in ways. First thing that comes to mind is an entire gallery / museum exhibition of entirely cast rubber sculptures. Perhaps we should do that.

How important do you think these more souvenir-like items are to the Ben Edgar project? Or really to any company for that matter? 

ROTENDA—I think they’re important. I now cannot see the Ben Edgar project without souvenirs. It’s the experience in them. Is this what qualifies a great souvenir? When it holds a universal experience (which can be shared) bigger than its physical scale. 

BEN—“When it holds a universal experience (which can be shared) bigger than its physical scale.” This quote!! This is so incredibly concise. [Laughter] You’re honestly too good with those. That quote could be this entire interview…done.

On Mies. Farnsworth House or S.R. Crown Hall IIT?

ROTENDA—Incredible buildings! My visual assessment to both says Farnsworth House! Which are you picking? I’m guessing you’ve been to the S.R. Crown Hall IIT? Actually, have we talked about Neue Nationalgalerie (New National Gallery) he did in Berlin?

BEN—Yes! How could I forget Neue Nationalgalerie. The overhangs are magic. What a great story as well on its restoration by Chipperfield Architects.